No ConCarry (Update: As Such)

14 09 2016

Jefferson City

The veto session starts today, and Nixon’s veto of SB 656 could be overturned before sunset.

Everyone keeps saying that SB 656 contains Constitutional Carry (concarry), and they’ve been saying it ever since this thing was born in committee, but I’m not seeing it and never have seen it.  Unless I’m missing something.  All I read is a bunch of tweaks.

Maybe they keep falsely claiming it has concarry because they don’t want it to pass for one or more of the tweaks it does make, and claiming it has concarry is the best way to gin up opposition. But I don’t know which one(s) of these tweaks are so horrible or objectionable.

UPDATE

Okay, I’ve asked around, and while there is technically no concarry language in SB 656, what it does do is effectively and on the sly implement concarry by removing the line-item in the list of actions that constitute unlawful use of a weapon (UUW) offenses that refers to carrying a concealed weapon (CCW) without a permit.  This blog’s very first post on September 15, 2003 was on the day of, and about, the General Assembly adopting our initial CCW provisions, and since it happened in September, you can deduce that it happened on an override of a gubernatorial veto.  Part of that package was to eliminate the stand-alone criminal offense of carrying a concealed weapon, and putting carrying without a permit as one of the many items in the UUW laundry list.  Now that it has been taken out, or it will be in about a month, there is no possible criminal sanction for carrying without a permit, except…

…What it does not accomplish is to allow CCW in places where carrying even with a valid permit is overtly legally prohibited, or privately prohibited by the establishment owner or agent per his latitude via state law. And it definitely doesn’t change the list of firearms-prohibited individuals per state or Federal law, meaning that firearms-prohibited individuals can’t legally carry even under SB 656 because they can’t legally possess, and they couldn’t get a permit anyway.

One thing it does is that while it removes carrying without a permit from the list of UUW violations, it adds one to it: What it does is that if you’re caught both knowingly carrying and knowingly possessing enough controlled substances that on the face of the action violate state felony PWID laws, (even before a conviction on that particular PWID action or even in the absence of any PWID conviction), that becomes a UUW line-item category. I actually remember that being shoved into SB 656 during hearings and markup, but now that I know that it goes in while CCW-sans-permit goes out, I now think it’s sort of a legal make-good. Remember, more than five years ago in this medium, I expressed my opposition to concarry in NAM-heavy states for technical reasons, and I think that this new UUW provision mostly compensates for those concerns.

The permit process is still in its same form, and that you will need to go through if you want reciprocity with other states, that is, the other states that recognizes Missouri’s permit.  Illinois still isn’t one of them.

Long and short is that if you’re not a prohibited person and you don’t carry in prohibited places and you’re not in the dope dealing and transporting business, SB 656 does effectively give you concarry.

Confoosled yet?


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13 responses

14 09 2016
countenance

Jamilah Nashweed did do like Colin Kaepernick this morning. I know she was threatening to do it, but I wasn’t in either chamber during the POA.

14 09 2016
countenance

House this morning and Senate late this afternoon successfully overrode on voter photo ID.

14 09 2016
AnAnon

Thanks for parsing this out. as you’ve mentioned before, people by and large don’t disobey the law or its spirit in this case so it may not be CCW for them either.

14 09 2016
countenance

The SB 656 override was made official while I was driving home. So far today, every Nixon veto that was put on the calendar to attempt to override has been overridden.

15 09 2016
countenance

Wham bam thank you ma’am, goodbye that’s all she wrote. Yesterday was the only day of the veto session, and it will be the last veto session of the Nixon years, and over his eight years, a total of 96 of his vetoes were overridden.

Chris Koster, this future awaits you.

15 09 2016
countenance

http://www.kmov.com/story/33106145/constitutional-carry-legislation-has-law-enforcement-gun-rights-activists-concerned

Even some gun rights advocates are uneasy with the change, especially the lack of training required to carry a firearm.

Firearms instructor Michael Meyers lobbied legislators in Jefferson City for years for the original concealed carry law, but no has concerns that, without requiring a permit, new gun owners will not only lack the hands-on training for gun safety, they won’t know the legal complexities of firearm use.

“The worst thing about it is the legal ramifications of the use of the firearm,” he said. “How is somebody going to know what to do if they use their firearm and have to deal with police and deal with the legal aspect of it? I suggest everybody still get training and learn that aspect of the law.”

Meyers teaches an eight-hour course for those wanting to obtain a concealed carry permit. For an example of how complicated legal gun ownership can be, he says about two hours of the class is spent on actual hands-on training. The other six hours cover the legalities of firearm use.

I can’t say I disagree with that. My concern is that CCW and the law thereof just got more weedy, that a lot of people are going to have trouble wrapping their minds around the new lay of the land. You’re going to have dickheads thinking now that anyone can carry any place any time, and that’s just not the case legally even when these provisions take effect, and that won’t be for another month. This is why I’m trying to unpack it and explain it. I’m loath even to call what happened “Constitutional Carry,” even though that’s sorta what we have effectively.

15 09 2016
Hard Right

If you shoot somebody, call a lawyer before you call the cops.

15 09 2016
Hard Right

15 09 2016
countenance

QED.

15 09 2016
countenance

The photo voter ID override doesn’t instantly implement it right away, what it does is send a referendum on the matter to the November ballot.

15 09 2016
countenance

Someone on Instapundit complained that the bill does away with the safety training requirement to get a permit.

It actually does not do that. You still need to go through the class to get the permit to carry.

Technically, you still need a permit to carry in order to carry. It’s just that, starting a month from now, there will be no legally extant criminal sanction for carrying without a permit, if you’re not a gun-prohibited person (state/Fed) and you don’t carry in hard or soft prohibited places.

Oh boy, I am not having a good feeling about this. This is going to be such a clusterfuck just in the matter of people understanding what actually happened, and that’s not even counting the actual execution.

15 09 2016
Hard Right

How much training does Bellcurvius take?

15 09 2016
countenance

Plenty:

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